Recursive subnetworks? I don't know what you mean by that, though at first glance it appears like a perfect way to fubar your ME network. I'd say it's something to avoid. Why would you think differently?
AE2
- Thread starter Nefroz
- Start date
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This is true, but the charger requires you have found at least one charged crystal, as it requires fluix. Once I have that, I'm good to go. That first piece can occasionally be frustrating though.
I personally find the new AE2 to be a lot of fun. The channels add a lot of interesting challenges.
As a whole package, I definately prefer AE2 to AE1. AE1 was too simple for my liking, hook everythign up to a single cable, and no matter how you do it, it'll work fine, to the point where it's the only automation you need (especially when adding extra cells), and nothing else stands up to it. It was NOT AN option, it was the only option. The only thing I dislike about AE2 is the hunt for metors for presses. The rest of the stuff that could be annoying I can put up with (especially as you don't need pure crystals to make accelerators) and I actviely enjoy channel management.
Four presses, and Skystone!
Which is an attractive building material in its own right. I don't mind world gen for skystone. Allthough in a pack with Railcraft (Abyssal stone) and Project Red (Basalt) the dark side of the spectrum is well covered.
Why would I think differently? Because it's dead easy, and works beautifully. The basic premise is that you can attach a storage bus to an ME interface, which allows you to access the sub network the interface is a part of. This can be done indefinitely, much like daisy chaining routers IRL. Google super soaryn drive for an extreme example.
I kinda like the meteors in AE2. But even if you don't like hunting them down it's something you only have to do for a bit in the early game and then you can forget about it.
One thing I found irritating about AE2 is that getting STARTED with it requires a semi-rare resource. I got screwed over by the RNG in my current world, hunting and quarrying madly for ages just to try and find a single charged certus quartz...
One thing I found irritating about AE2 is that getting STARTED with it requires a semi-rare resource. I got screwed over by the RNG in my current world, hunting and quarrying madly for ages just to try and find a single charged certus quartz...
"Recursive" is perhaps a bit misleading (I know it's called that, there's even an achievement for building it). It seems to indicate that a given (sub-)network somehow can become a sub-network to itself, or at least that's how I would interpret it if I didn't know what was meant. "Hierarchical sub-networks" seems more accurate IMHO.
In that case, "recursive" is the correct term, but what's the use of it? I'd guess the "achievement" refers to something that would result in an infinite loop and a crash if the code didn't look out for that specific possibility and prevent you from suffering the consequences.
@Bagman817:
Of course subnetworks in itself are immensely useful and I have been using them often. The problem is the "recursive" part - that shouldn't result in anything pleasant.
All your AE2, in a "simple" 5x5x5 cube... kudos to the designer, it turned my inelegant spacious mess into a thing of beauty. 
I put it right smack dab in the middle of my base, a true centerpiece.
I put it right smack dab in the middle of my base, a true centerpiece.
A semantics issue then. We'll call it 'daisy chain networking' then, if you like. The point, of course, is that it allows infinite devices on 1 channel of the main network.
The fact that this is not only possible but intended makes me question why have channels at all. Honestly Even though I understand channels I wasn't even going to use AE for storage on DW20. Unfortunately unless you just want them in manual chests you're kind of SOL as there is no other alternative. In the end channels take up either too much space or resources or both.
Yes you can either organize your network cables with anchors and colors or use p2p networks. The idea with p2p being to save resources. Of course with the amount of resources you use on the storage buses, interfaces, p2p thingies... AE2 uses as many resources as it holds, it feels like. It feels a little like greg tech (from what I hear); grindy for the sake of being grindy.
Not to mention something is going on with it, because every time I get near my ae system's main controller my system seriously lags. I can be across the map at my friends base accessing it and everything runs smooth. The 2nd I'm in the room it starts lagging. This is not the first time I've noticed it. I really think ae2 is far more system intensive than ae1 was.
I will say that morph certainly helps ease the pain of having to find the meteors. And turtles help ease the issue of finding the chest and breaking it. Normally they do so a lot quicker than a pick can. ;P
Can't say I agree. The only reason AE2 cables take up more space is that EnderIO's ME conduits aren't a feasible alternative for standard cables everywhere any more. Regarding resources, there is a large initial investments but after that resource consumption is minimal if you don't build the biggest storage modules - which as a rule you rarely need since the number of item types is more of a limiting factor than the number of items of any one type. If you want a resource hog, look for Extra Cells.
As for why not use subnetworking exclusively? It is, actually, more resource, intensive than the channels. Also, subnetworks don't have access to their parent networks so you can't attach autocrafting elements further down the chain. A set of many small subnetworks will never be as versatile as a well-designed system that subnetworks only if that serves a specific purpose.
It can end up like that, but only if you don't use AE2 for its intended purpose: use autocrafting to help the system expand itself. If you do it right, after setting things up you'll never have to craft a single crystal or processor by hand anymore. I tend to set up automated processor making even before I build the network, crystal growing immediately after building its core, and the first autocrafting recipes that go into the interfaces around my molecular assemblers are for cables and small storage components.
There are other alternatives out there. Logistics Pipes being one; and one that I'm not sure why is not in the pack. Draconic Evolution has some interesting chests options. I wasn't referring to Ender IO though it does have... an interesting sorting system. Even if the filters are limited.
I do have my charger, inscriber, and growth accelerators fully automated. That's not the grind... it's the finding of and collection of quartz, both nether and not... I know you can quarry the nether. I have a few sand filled chunks as it is.
in the end I miss the multiblock structure that was auto crafting. Now I have 4 multi block structures so I can craft * cough* I'm sorry que more than one crafting task at a time. Juggling the patterns vs ME interfaces and molecular assemblers, if one task uses an element from the same interface or uses the same assembler, be prepared to wait for a day for it get done and wonder (hmm why did I go though and painstakingly craft 64k crafting computers) yeah the bottle neck in auto crafting will almost always be the interface/assembler vs placement of patterns.
These tasks can take up so much time in a mod that was originally hailed as a solution to spending time designing sorting networks and autocrafting. It's trying to be something it's not. Instead of a support mod, it's trying to take up too much of my time. I know people are saying "well it's too easy"... well duh, that part of the game was supposed to be easy... That's why we were interested in the mod in the first place.
Don't get me wrong, yes channels have made me "think" more about how to construct my network. And make me actually make a sheep farm... and actually set up production of glass... It really should be a construct it and forget it. IMO
I do have my charger, inscriber, and growth accelerators fully automated. That's not the grind... it's the finding of and collection of quartz, both nether and not... I know you can quarry the nether. I have a few sand filled chunks as it is.
in the end I miss the multiblock structure that was auto crafting. Now I have 4 multi block structures so I can craft * cough* I'm sorry que more than one crafting task at a time. Juggling the patterns vs ME interfaces and molecular assemblers, if one task uses an element from the same interface or uses the same assembler, be prepared to wait for a day for it get done and wonder (hmm why did I go though and painstakingly craft 64k crafting computers) yeah the bottle neck in auto crafting will almost always be the interface/assembler vs placement of patterns.
These tasks can take up so much time in a mod that was originally hailed as a solution to spending time designing sorting networks and autocrafting. It's trying to be something it's not. Instead of a support mod, it's trying to take up too much of my time. I know people are saying "well it's too easy"... well duh, that part of the game was supposed to be easy... That's why we were interested in the mod in the first place.
Don't get me wrong, yes channels have made me "think" more about how to construct my network. And make me actually make a sheep farm... and actually set up production of glass... It really should be a construct it and forget it. IMO
You have a point there. Autocrafting has become quite less efficient and takes up vastly more space than before, and it doesn't help that the most efficient pattern placement is also the least intuitive in terms of organizing content. Storage, channels and autocrafting with machines, that all works well, but standard internal autocrafting has lost something in the transition to AE2.
@Nefroz
As much as I like AE2's newfound complexity you have stated all the things I dislike about AE2. Meteor RNG and the horrid press mechanic is annoying, but while the former is unavoidably annoying, the processors and crystal growth can be a rewarding challenge to overcome. That being said it makes early game AE2 a bit of a pain.
The meteor RNG however was such an incredibly asinine design decision it actually baffled me. It was like seeing a sprinter with a 10 meter lead stop 30cm from the finish line only to belt their head in with a steel sledge... loseing the race.
As much as I like AE2's newfound complexity you have stated all the things I dislike about AE2. Meteor RNG and the horrid press mechanic is annoying, but while the former is unavoidably annoying, the processors and crystal growth can be a rewarding challenge to overcome. That being said it makes early game AE2 a bit of a pain.
The meteor RNG however was such an incredibly asinine design decision it actually baffled me. It was like seeing a sprinter with a 10 meter lead stop 30cm from the finish line only to belt their head in with a steel sledge... loseing the race.
The inscriber is actually one of the nicer things in AE2 for me.
It's like the quartz charger thingummy in that it's a fiddly pig of a process if you do it manually but it's fairly straightforward to automate if you understand the different faces of the machine.
It's like the quartz charger thingummy in that it's a fiddly pig of a process if you do it manually but it's fairly straightforward to automate if you understand the different faces of the machine.
It's remediable with 10 iron ingots and 2 chests, (2 hoppers).
Indeed so. The inscribers are very easy to automate if you don't try to get fancy and do everything with one inscriber and Steve's Factory Manager like DW20 did in his series. I usually have them automated using only EnderIO conduits even before I build my ME network - put raw materials (of any combination, and in any amount up to the chest's limit) into a chest, wait a little as the inscribers make what they can from the raw materials you put in, take your processors out. If you have the resources, you can make several stacks of each kind of processor in one batch that way. Once I have my AE2 autocrafting set up, all I need to to is add an interface and reroute one pipe from the chest to the interface.
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