Lava help

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2122000nrm

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Jul 29, 2019
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Hello everyone! Recently I found that forcicium can produce 1.25 Million per forcicium. The MFFS extractor can accept either MJ or EU power. Since I want more EU ATM than MJ, I am using MJ to power the extractor. Here is the question. If I use UU matter to give craft Netherrack to a magma crucible, and produce infinite lava using the magmatic engines->magma crucible, would it be worth to make Netherrack from UU matter since I am using the lava to power engines that will eventually get me 1.25 M ?

Information

I am on the direwolf20 pack(and on a server) so pumping lava isn't the best idea
3 UU matter gives me 16 Netherrack
169,000 eu gives me 1 UU matter since I am using scrap
1 Netherrack gives me I believe 1000MB which will be distributed to 10 magmatics
That is all I know

I also have 3 MV Solars running.. So 192 eu/t during the day
 

happypyro

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Jul 29, 2019
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sorry to tell you, the magma crucible was nerfed, infinite lava with it is no longer an option
 

TangentialThreat

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Jul 29, 2019
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The magma crucible is no longer a practical source of MJ. Using UU-matter to make netherrack would be kind of absurd anyway.

You might want to just power the beast with some of its own EU.
 

ItharianEngineering

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Jul 29, 2019
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sorry to tell you, the magma crucible was nerfed, infinite lava with it is no longer an option
Infinite lava from cobblestone, yes. Netherrak still only takes 12k MJ to turn into lava, while the magmatic engines generate 18k MJ from 1 bucket. 6k MJ gain. He wants to take that net gained energy and turn it into UU-Matter to make more lava by converting the power through a MFFS extractor. The problem is at 166,667 EU per UU you need 500,001 EU for 16 Netherrak or 31250 EU/netherrak which you can't get from this conversion, especially when you lose so much power to conversion from netherrak to lava.
 

2122000nrm

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Jul 29, 2019
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The magma crucible is no longer a practical source of MJ. Using UU-matter to make netherrack would be kind of absurd anyway.

You might want to just power the beast with some of its own EU.
Then I'd only be getting 250K and its not worth it.

Any other suggestions for powering the MFFS extractor?
Couldn't I get infinite eu by powering the magma crucible with electrical engines and then powering the MFFS extractor to get me 1.25 M eu ?
 

Hydra

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Jul 29, 2019
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EE's transfer EU to MJ at a 5:2 ratio.

So no, as far as I know these exploits are now all fixed. I mean, if you want to cheat why not just NEI in a load of fuel?
 

Bibble

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Jul 29, 2019
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Then I'd only be getting 250K and its not worth it.

Any other suggestions for powering the MFFS extractor?
Couldn't I get infinite eu by powering the magma crucible with electrical engines and then powering the MFFS extractor to get me 1.25 M eu ?
As far as I know, most of the reasonable loopholes have been closed. The mods do not intend for you to set up a system abusing the difference between them for free stuff.

With regards to actual generation, I usually find that it depends on what you have available. If you have a large tree farm, consider making biofuel (adding in a wheat farm for the mulch), and making a steam boiler to power the MFFS.
Or, if you are underground, it might be worth considering a nuke for the purpose. Or, if above ground, you could consider solars/wind.

Also, I'm a little confused as to why lava pumping isn't the best idea. I, too, play the DW20 pack, and all you need to do is grab a tesseract or two, find a secluded spot and pump to the overworld. If you're a bit paranoid, too, then set up a station to pump, and run an MFFS system there too.
 

OmegaJasam

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Jul 29, 2019
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Making lava in the crucible with coble and putting it through the geothermals is one of the more efficient ways of converting, but not enough for infinite loops.
On the other hand it does allow methods like Stevecart Tree Farm -> Solid + liquid fuel boilers -> lava -> geothermal.
 

2122000nrm

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Jul 29, 2019
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Pumping lava is sorta limited/banned
We have soooo many people draining lava, it's ATM impossible to venture into the nether without lagging
There are sooo many moving lava blocks
I do have 1 peat farm and 1 tree farm, the peat is automatic and the tree farm isn't yet
I am using biogas to power it right now from wheat, because my friend has tonnes of unnessary amounts of it
EE's transfer EU to MJ at a 5:2 ratio.

So no, as far as I know these exploits are now all fixed. I mean, if you want to cheat why not just NEI in a load of fuel?
On a server and creative is not allowed

As far as I know, most of the reasonable loopholes have been closed. The mods do not intend for you to set up a system abusing the difference between them for free stuff.

With regards to actual generation, I usually find that it depends on what you have available. If you have a large tree farm, consider making biofuel (adding in a wheat farm for the mulch), and making a steam boiler to power the MFFS.
Or, if you are underground, it might be worth considering a nuke for the purpose. Or, if above ground, you could consider solars/wind.

Also, I'm a little confused as to why lava pumping isn't the best idea. I, too, play the DW20 pack, and all you need to do is grab a tesseract or two, find a secluded spot and pump to the overworld. If you're a bit paranoid, too, then set up a station to pump, and run an MFFS system there too.
I did not want to take it to a boiler level, as I doubt I have the infrastructure ATM anyways
I used 10 geothermals to power my beginning set up, worked out great with lava from the nether , but 264 with Solars wasn't doing it. Built 2 more MV Solars, but I wanted something else than a nuclear reactor to finish it off. I personally hate wind. It is inconsistent compared to solars.
If anyone has any suggestions to either generating around 45ish MJ or producing mass amounts of EU, ill take anything.

If someone has an idea but you think it's too expensive, list it, I am VERY rich on that server.
 

Fuzzlewhumper

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Jul 29, 2019
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I prefer a much more automated method manner that I don't have to resort to pumping lava, and it involves wood.

These are my prioritized steps to getting all the power I want that's renewable and so far as I know ... not a cheat.

I generally use this as my starting strategy for getting a renewable supply of energy/fuel. All I generally need to do is dig down, find three diamonds, and come back up. The red stone to make a turtle is found usually when I try to find the three diamonds. Come back up and craft a turtle, give it a diamond pickaxe and it's about on. Sometimes I find me some lava, turn it to obsidian, and tell the darn turtle to use my pickaxe to get me two pieces of obsidian (or more) so I can craft obsidian pipe (the only other item that's hard to get early on in a world for me). If you don't know turtle speak...

Give the turtle a piece of wood or coal or some fuel. Type refuel() and it will eat the fuel. Just needs a little to get some obsidian.

Type lua first, then these commands will work. The interface for working with turtles says how to get out of lua mode at the bottom of the little control screen. turtle.dig() (will make your turtle dig what it's facing. The item is stored in the turtles inventory. turtle.forward() and dig again assuming he needs to get another piece. When your done and got your obsidian, turtle.up() and put a cobble or two under him so when you pick him up he doesn't take a visit in lava and die. Depending on your situation, if he is on top of obsidian, type turtle.digdown() and he'll take out that piece of obsidian below him. Anyhow, that's how to get the resources to get to this point...

1. Make a mining turtle.
2. I right click the turtle and type "label set UWC" This is done so that your turtle will save the program you download and not be deleted each time you pick up your turtle. Also preserves it's fuel, so when you pick up a turtle and put it back down ... it's ready to go with it's memory intact and fuel as well.
3. I then type "pastebin get iVKtHaWk UWC" To run the program just type UWC and the program has a menu of items to choose from

I recommend visiting http://www.computercraft.info/forum...ltimate-wood-chopper-selfbuildingmenueasy086/
and that's where you learn how to use this toy. :)

4. Okay, assuming you've got your automated tree farm ready to go after following his tutorial, you need to provide an infinite source of bone meal.
Oh, wait, that involves using a skeleton spawner and an automated process of converting to bonemeal and putting that in the chest ...
Well, I prefer making a 5x5x10 tall enclosed room above the bonemeal chest and off to the side. I put an obsidian pipe in the bottom, and cobble pipe running to the top of the bonemeal chest. Then I put water in the four corners of my 5x5 and place sulfur torches on every wall face I can, I also put a center column and put torches there too. Whammo, you now have an infinite supply of 'bonemeal' Well, it's some red goo stuff but hey, it works just like bonemeal and it is infinite.

5. Look at the design of his furnace with the red stone engine, iron pipe and chest setup. He puts wood in the furnace, it turns to charcoal, and then it gets routed through the pipes into the furnace for fuel or into a storage chest 50/50 chance. Fortunately it produces so much in the way of charcoal, that it's never ever run out for me.

6. Here's where you can build what you want and make an infinite supply of charcoal. Pipe out the collected wood from the wood chest into your system of hoppers and furnaces and pipes and storage boxes (or overflow box). I threw something together but you could get all fancy and make routers, sorters, and so on to handle this part more efficiently if ya want. But the charcoal you make in your furnaces is the infinite source of energy at this point.

If ya need more, make another farm or two or three. Heck, if you don't want to use charcoal, you could just harvest the wood, auto craft it into planks and burn that instead for 3k fuel instead of 4k fuel.

Once I did a small one of these, I just chuckle every time I see people pump lava and think, "I'll never run out." And to top that off ... I have a steady stream of wood and coal whenever I need it. Oh, and if you wanna get extra fancy, the saplings produced by this could be harvested for bio fuel I suppose. Just gotta make sure to leave at least one or two stacks in the chest for your turtle to use to make more trees.

As the author of this turtle program states, fir trees make for the best source of wood for this since they grow flawlessly even with leaves in the way.

Note: The wood chest sometimes gets a fir tree sapling in it, when pulling from the wood chest with a dumb pipe, put a diamond pipe in there to dump the sapling out before it heads to your furnace and gets clogged.

Admittedly, lava is more cool (so to speak).

Secondary note: Turtles when the chunk is unloaded, cease operation and stop running their program. If that happens, you'll need to go track down where your turtle left off, finish cutting down the tree yourself, put the turtle back onto his 'base' spot pointing the direction the author states to face, and then you're ready to go again. Chunk loaders prevent this problem for the most part unless the server comes down for some reason and then you're back to maintaining.

So that's it downside, turtles cease to work outside of loaded chunks or server resets. Lava pumps don't need that kind of maintenance though.
 

2122000nrm

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Jul 29, 2019
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Thanks for that idea, I might implement it depending whether its worth it or not, could you give me some eu numbers and some MJ numbers so I get a clue on how much I can produce with 1 farm? And I still am looking for ideas, preferably automated and I get a huge gain of power whether MJ or eu.
Thanks for all the ideas
 

Fuzzlewhumper

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Jul 29, 2019
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A fir tree is a 2x2 tree. It's approximately 40 blocks tall. The turtle mines about 2 blocks a second.

So lets just use 2 blocks a second. Each block is 750 eu raw. You can auto craft the block into 4 planks and get 3000 eu that way immediately. So, 6000 eu a second. Divide by 20 (20 tics in a second) and you come up with 300 eu a tic. Tone that back for when the turtle is planting a new tree or going back to its base to refuel, drop off raw wood, get supplies ... Conservatively 200 eu a tic.

If you put in about 8 iron furnaces with pipes, redstone engines and hoppers, you could probably convert the raw wood to charcoal and get better numbers though. Figuring 2 chunks of wood a second ... grr, crummy math on the way.

Charcoal in an iron furnace cooks 10 chunks of wood in about 60 seconds.

Let's calculate over a minute and then divide back down to per tic.

2x60 = 120 pieces of wood.

Eight iron furnace = 8 pieces of wood made into coal are used to cook 80 pieces of wood. We could probably bump it up to 10 iron furnace now that I think about it.
Ten iron furnace = 10 pieces of wood that were made into coal are used to cook 100 pieces of wood. Ending up with 100 pieces of coal in a minute.
100 pieces of charcoal can produce 4000 eu in an generator(s). 400,000 eu a minute.
Divide by 60 seconds and again by 20 tics and we get 333 eu a tic. Toning that back for possible slower turtle speed, 250 eu conservatively.

All in all, not too shabby for being renewable and free. Of course one would need to make enough generators to burn the supply at an equal level of production to get stable numbers.
 
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2122000nrm

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Jul 29, 2019
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a ton of Generators is not a problems, I have a stack of them placed in my basement using Peat, and the extra scrap from my mass fab. Will use it
 

Slaagathor

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Jul 29, 2019
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A fir tree is a 2x2 tree. It's approximately 40 blocks tall. The turtle mines about 2 blocks a second.

So lets just use 2 blocks a second. Each block is 750 eu raw. You can auto craft the block into 4 planks and get 3000 eu that way immediately. So, 6000 eu a second. Divide by 20 (20 tics in a second) and you come up with 300 eu a tic. Tone that back for when the turtle is planting a new tree or going back to its base to refuel, drop off raw wood, get supplies ... Conservatively 200 eu a tic.

If you don't mind using a sawmill, for a very low MJ usage, you can get 6 planks per log, and one piece of sawdust. Use an autocrafting table to combine the sawdust into compressed sawadust, and turn the compressed sawdust into charcoal.

6 planks = 4500 EU, and 1/8 eventual charcoal = 500EU, so you can get a fair bit more EU per log. Its how I'm processing my Steve's Carts tree farm
 

Guswut

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Jul 29, 2019
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A fir tree is a 2x2 tree. It's approximately 40 blocks tall.

Fir trees appear to be around 30m to 40m in height, so I'd say update your estimates to 35m. Also, why not go with redwood trees? They're between 35m to 50m in height.

You could also reasonably use two turtles per tree to double the speed at the cost of doubling the cost (similar to LP and HP boiler, including higher startup cost of two turtles per tree instead of one).


The turtle mines about 2 blocks a second. So lets just use 2 blocks a second.

It's closer to about one block every 3/5th to 7/10th or a second, based upon measuring the sound of breakage against a clock with seconds displayed. Just a point for possible irregularities in output.

Each block is 750 eu raw. You can auto craft the block into 4 planks and get 3000 eu that way immediately. So, 6000 eu a second. Divide by 20 (20 tics in a second) and you come up with 300 eu a tic. Tone that back for when the turtle is planting a new tree or going back to its base to refuel, drop off raw wood, get supplies ... Conservatively 200 eu a tic.

Given previous irregularities, until otherwise tested (which I'll surely do for the sake of science) I'd say closer to 150eu a tick. Which is still fairly excellent!



If you put in about 8 iron furnaces with pipes, redstone engines and hoppers, you could probably convert the raw wood to charcoal and get better numbers though. Figuring 2 chunks of wood a second ... grr, crummy math on the way.

Charcoal in an iron furnace cooks 10 chunks of wood in about 60 seconds.

Electro furances are a bit more efficient (http://wiki.industrial-craft.net/index.php?title=Electro_Furnace, 390EU versus 400EU) and 12.5% faster to boot. You'll already have the setup for EU production, so this increases your output a bit and is worth considering over the course of the system's usage in increase efficiency.

There isn't much in the way of additional costs for the increased efficiency/speed of these as you'll have more or less everything needed already set up (power/etc).





Toning that back for possible slower turtle speed, 250 eu conservatively.

All in all, not too shabby for being renewable and free. Of course one would need to make enough generators to burn the supply at an equal level of production to get stable numbers.
And a way to get enough saplings to keep the system supplied (may be able to be constantly supplied via natural drops from breaking of trees between cycles, otherwise a dedicated sapling system will be needed) as well as bonemeal (should be as simple as a T3 skeleton spawner and drop kill system).
But yes, this seems like a fairly interesting, and, most importantly, low entry cost way (three gems for an axe for your turtle is the highest cost at this point, as well as the time needed to collect a bunch of bones/saplings) to produce a great deal of EU.
It should be easy enough to network the entire system up to pause after a cycle when your energy storage is full (no need to harvest more logs, set up your system to be able to store a full cycle's worth of logs in the system before being processed so as to allow the system to never waste logs and only run when needed).
I'll be trying this setup on my latest world to try and stabilize a one-tree (likely redwood to minimize sapling/bonemeal costs) system to see what output I get with what setup, and how scaling works. Good show either way!
 

Fuzzlewhumper

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I think the fir tree doesn't check to see if the leaves are in the way before growing, so it's for sure going to grow with one application of bone meal.

I'll check red wood though, it may do as well.

Love the idea about sawmill!!! I'll try adding that! :)

The bone meal I'm using comes from Sulfur Torches. It's made by taking gun powder, putting it in a furnace and producing sulfur. Then combine sulfur with a stick for four torches. The torches occasionally drop a substance that looks like red-seeds. I think it's called sulfur goo. This substance is used identically to bone meal and has the same effect. I built a 5x5x10 room with an obsidian pipe in the bottom and four blocks of water to push the drops to the pipe.