Really stupid things that people have said about Modded MC(Off topicness makes moderators tired)

Is this a good idea?

  • Yes

    Votes: 66 18.2%
  • No

    Votes: 18 5.0%
  • if people don't get out of control

    Votes: 68 18.8%
  • POTATOES

    Votes: 210 58.0%

  • Total voters
    362
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Azzanine

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Jul 29, 2019
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Well, the environment has caused me some headaches, as now a large number of people seem to think that a decent pack needs every mod Minetweakered to unrecognizability, but the popularity is about the same as it has ever been when correcting for confounding factors - eg being in Monster.


Because of the way RC is coded, little can actually be done; the custom machines and recipe tables, as a nice side effect, stop plugins like MT from being able to remove their recipes, and I did beef up their code a bit to make it more difficult, or even near-impossible, to do so with a custom-written mod. Additionally, neither ModTweaker or Custom Configs support changing RC, both by my request (and Ganymede was generous enough to give me a "blacklist mod as output" hook to prevent adding new recipes for gating items). I am also, as of v4, going to close the other hole by stopping MT from doing the same (ideally by making MT simply ignore those lines; I do not want to crash the game). I have yet to figure out how to accomplish that.

Hmm, it really seems like you are putting a lot of effort in to fighting the status quo, I just wonder what returns you expect from your effort.
I agree giving everyone free reign over your mods balance is not only annoying on a support basis but can be detrimental to the mod development it's self, as why bother developing if everyone else is just going to do it. However pushing against the players desires can also have a negative effect on the uptake of your mods and the image of your mods, which I assume you value so long as it doesn't go against your core values.

Hopefully something positive comes from the measures you are putting in place to insulate your mod from tweaking. But my gut tells me all it will do is push potential players away from your mod/s,
I hope you are carefully evaluating all potential outcomes of such actions. In other words; From my perspective at the very best nothing bad nor good will come out of this.

Makes sense, dragons sure do live longer than humans ponies :D
And what about squids? ... :p
Except if the pony is an Alicorn...
 

Reika

RotaryCraft Dev
FTB Mod Dev
Sep 3, 2013
5,079
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550
Toronto, Canada
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Hmm, it really seems like you are putting a lot of effort in to fighting the status quo, I just wonder what returns you expect from your effort.
I agree giving everyone free reign over your mods balance is not only annoying on a support basis but can be detrimental to the mod development it's self, as why bother developing if everyone else is just going to do it. However pushing against the players desires can also have a negative effect on the uptake of your mods and the image of your mods, which I assume you value so long as it doesn't go against your core values.
Before I prevented modification, I had to deal with around five people a day chewing me out for their own problems created by tweaking RC. Despite the PR problems it has caused, it has in fact reduced the number of headaches I had to deal with.
 
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Celestialphoenix

Too Much Free Time
Nov 9, 2012
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Tartarus.. I mean at work. Same thing really.
A lot of it is down to the individual mod design and balance points- the vast majority are balanced around material count, so running a different worldgen or having alternate shortcuts to gaining materials can somewhat overthrow the stock balance, hence why MineTweaker is used a lot to counter this.
Its basically a numbers game, which is what MT is good at. Player skill on the other hand is a lot harder to quantify- which is where MT falls down.

Reika's mods are fully gated around player skill, so the availability of/shortcuts to stock materials won't significantly impact the balance points- on condition there isn't anything that circumvents the skill tree. At best MT is pretty much useless here, at worst it really throws a screwdriver into the jet engine.
The 'return' we all get is the continual quality of the game, thats always the best experience that it can give.
 

CoolSquid

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
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If I understand correctly, I may modify the heck out of all your smaller mods, just not Chromaticraft and Rotarycraft and their addons?
 

ljfa

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
2,761
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If I understand correctly, I may modify the heck out of all your smaller mods, just not Chromaticraft and Rotarycraft and their addons?
Well not totally. Notice the colon after "My other mods have a bit more flexibility" in Reika's license.
 

Reika

RotaryCraft Dev
FTB Mod Dev
Sep 3, 2013
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550
Toronto, Canada
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If I understand correctly, I may modify the heck out of all your smaller mods, just not Chromaticraft and Rotarycraft and their addons?
Within certain guidelines, yes. For SSP (private packs), go ahead and modify whatever you want, including for the tech mods. Hell, build a custom version of the code if you want. (Just no tech support if you do, and of course no redistribution).

As for servers, the non-progression mods have a lot of flexibility, but there are still rules.

For "public" packs - defined as any pack intended for or available to anyone not associated with the creator directly - the big rule is that while you can change specifics or tweak some behavior, fundamental changes that make the mod blatantly disagree with any documentation (for example, turning off GeoStrata worldgen and making its stone craftable instead), because they will lead to a large number of misled people and false bug reports, cannot be made. A couple more fine rules are making any changes obvious (eg for Expanded Redstone, making a block not work (rather than properly removing it), which looks like a bug), and of course not doing for malicious reasons (eg deliberately generating bug reports, or making the good parts of a mod admin-only). And of course the other four pack rules still have to be followed.


Semiprivate packs - defined as any pack created for and only available for and as a player of one server - have a bit more flexibility. Obviously the malicious modification rule still applies, as do the four other pack rules, but now more significant changes can be made so long as the motives behind the editing are legitimate; these are the rules on my thread. Provided your plans are not like Nentify's or like that one guy who modified MeteorCraft to target one player he did not like, you should not have issues with this.

Neither semiprivate nor public packs may make and distribute custom builds, the main reason being concerns over things sneakily inserted.
 
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chbachman

Guest
Before I prevented modification, I had to deal with around five people a day chewing me out for their own problems created by tweaking RC. Despite the PR problems it has caused, it has in fact reduced the number of headaches I had to deal with.
You deal with people wrong, then. If somebody stupid is yelling at you to fix your mod, paste some link to a EAQ that answers their questions. If they come back after that, block them. You get nothing from arguing with a person.

At least, if I ever get this type of flak, that is what I will do.
 

Antaioz

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
237
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However pushing against the players desires can also have a negative effect on the uptake of your mods and the image of your mods, which I assume you value so long as it doesn't go against your core values.

I adore the fact that RC has a 'no modification' policy, it means whenever and wherever I load it up, its the same, no learning new stupid recipes... so refreshing. (I made a big rant about this on the overused/overhyped mods thread a while back).
 
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Reika

RotaryCraft Dev
FTB Mod Dev
Sep 3, 2013
5,079
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550
Toronto, Canada
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You deal with people wrong, then. If somebody stupid is yelling at you to fix your mod, paste some link to a EAQ that answers their questions. If they come back after that, block them. You get nothing from arguing with a person.

At least, if I ever get this type of flak, that is what I will do.
Good luck. The people who cause this sort of problem are also the people who balk - and often complain - at the idea of having to read such things, and thus their behavior is unaffected. (Also, what level of willingness to research would you expect from somebody making bedrock breaker require bedrock?).
Blocking them is also impossible. The only means I have to do that is to start reporting them left, right and center, and not only is that process slow (it often takes hours to get a post removed) it often does not work, as they come right back under a new name. Additionally, most often these people are "hit and run"; that is, rarely does one specific person ever comes back after one complaining, making after-the-fact blocks useless, and doing nothing to stop the tide of 5 people a day.

I adore the fact that RC has a 'no modification' policy, it means whenever and wherever I load it up, its the same, no learning new stupid recipes... so refreshing. (I made a big rant about this on the overused/overhyped mods thread a while back).
Link please. :D
 
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Antaioz

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Jul 29, 2019
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Hyperme

Popular Member
Apr 3, 2013
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or like that one guy who modified MeteorCraft to target one player he did not like

I'm sure this is hilarious until the player works out what's happening, and starts standing around other people's stuff. And which point things take a decidedly less hilarious turn, as mr. server admin has to deal with every getting hit by Meteors.
 

Strikingwolf

New Member
Jul 29, 2019
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http://forum.feed-the-beast.com/threads/overated-problematic-misused-mods.55997/page-9#post-854729
last relevant post is page 11 I think.

I got a bit of what seemed like ignorance when I posted that, people defending minetweaker/modtweaker without actually listening to my argument and point. This seems to be a theme when I get into arguments. But I find it amusing to answer posts by quoting older posts of mine, so fun.
I like Minetweaker/modtweaker...though it is overused by so many people. I only think a couple of people should be messing with recipe balance that intensely
 
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